Monday, June 20, 2005

LAT FINALLY GETS IT RIGHT
In a follow-up story to SANA's bust in OC, Sam Quinones makes a couple of startling but long overdue admissions in the LA Times. For the first time, the LAT finally cops to the fact that the famous EME gang "truce" way back in 1992 was a "ruse." Anyone familiar with the subject knows that it was never a truce. It was merely a change in the rules of engagement. The edict from Sana, Chuco and Boxer was not "no more killing." It was "no more drivebys." A big difference. If somebody needed to be checked, it was going to be up close and personal. They said as much on FBI surveilance tapes which have always been available to the public after they were used as evidence in the big RICO cases mentioned in my previous post. The Times never bothered to look.

For years after the 1992 "park meetings" the LAT has held the opinion that LE was making the violence worse by taking "peace keeping" shot callers off the streets. The Times would back up that contention by quoting the usual suspects like Malcolm Klein, Diego Vigil, Greg Boyle and more recently, Tom Hayden. Hayden, in fact, repeated the "peace keeper" myth in his book "Street Wars." And like an echo chamber, the myth was picked up from that book and repeated in other media. If the Times writers were at all familiar with the dynamics of the relationship between the Eme and the neighborhoods, they'd know that a shot caller doesn't need to be on the street to control activity. They can do it from the SHU or anywhere.

The Times has also never written about the other items on the park meeeting agenda: taxation and organizing SOCAL gangs under the Sureno flag. This piece by Quinones finally sets the record straight.

Correct me if I'm wrong on this one, but I think this article is the first major media acknowledgement that Boxer has debriefed. I follow this stuff as closely as I can, but I don't recall ever reading about Boxer debriefing prior to this piece.

Quinones went to some savvy guys for his piece: Rich Valdemar, Leo Duarte and Al Valdez. The collective knowledge of those three is encyclopedic and anyone who has worked with them or watched them testify as gang experts knows they go deep and way back. They all get props from both sides of the street for being fair and even-handed in their assessement of crimes and criminals.

52 comments:

Anonymous said...

I read the LAT article and what impressed me the most was that he (sana) supposedly called shots for a prison yard from the streets. Its hard to believe what the media says since they have a tendency to exaggerate but if its true he ran a prison yard from the streets, its a new one for me.

middle-aged white reporter said...

Wally, I too was impressed with Sam Quinones' LA Times article on Sana and the so-called EME truce. I have a couple of bones of contention to pick with your post, however:

1. What is your deal with Greg Boyle, Diego Vigil and Mac Klein???? If you want to continue bash them, do it based on fact, please.

While admittedly Hayden’s big into the truce/peacemaker model, the other three ACTIVELY disagree with that approach. If you think not, I challenge you to cite a single source or quote that suggests otherwise. All three---particularly Boyle and Klein---believe that the whole truce thing actually validates the gang structure rather than pulling guys away from the gang, and therefore does MUCH more harm than good.

Again, feel free to prove me wrong on this. But I'm betting you can't do it.

2. Also, I believe you’re wrong about the EME meetings not precipitating a truce. I can’t speak about the first Orange County meeting, but I was on the street the day of the first Boyle Heights meeting in late May of 1992, and talked to at least 20 guys from three different gangs, minutes after they came back from the park. (And have talked to many others from a host of different gangs in the intervening years.) Surveillance tapes or no, I can tell you, it was clearly the understanding of the guys who attended that first meeting that there WAS, in fact, truce of sorts. (Yet, admittedly not all of the Eastside gangs signed on.)

Not that there was anything noble about this whole thing. There wasn’t. The deal was, as you said, there were new rules set down for the violence: no drive-bys, no shooting into houses, etc. To blast one had to walk up to an enemy, hit ‘em up, if they claimed a neighborhood, you could shoot.. If not, you had to walk away.

Yet, what was the most startling about those first few weeks after the EME meetings, was the belief among the gang members who attended that the slate was wiped clean, that grudges and deaths of the past were to be largely forgotten, and that everyone was starting over from, year zero, so to speak.

Again, as you say, there was nothing romantic about this. It was all about business, power and control. And, of course, as you and the Times have stated, it was then that the system of taxes and all that jazz was instituted.

But, for a brief period, the violence on the east side did slow down.

Wally, I think your blog is valuable---and far more accurate than much of what one finds in the press. But your constant theme of nobody-but-law-enforcement-really “gets it”-with regard to gangs……becomes extremely tiresome. Plus, it just ain't true, babe.

CONEX said...

the middle aged white reporter needs to come out of the closet because the truth is those meetings and the truces where meant to make it easier for the eme to do drug bizz, dont for once believe that they give a shit about who dies or lives because they dont, i went to those meetings and yes i was a banger in the mix at the time but i disagreed with the plan because if im going to be doing my bizz i sure am not going to share the profits with anyone, shit im the one taking the risk not any1 else, and people better wise up soon cause if they get control of the streets better then you will see them take on the police and we will all be screwed real good, that reporter must not live in the ghetto and does not know whats up with father boyle and the rest of them guys, SO WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE... DOMESTIC TERRORISM..

CONEX said...

AND THAT WALK UP IDEA NEVER WORKED ANYWAYS THEY R STILL DOING DRIVEBYS AND SHOOTING INNOCENT CIVILIANS, THE ONLY THING THAT IS WORKING IS NOW LE IS GETTING TAX MONEY TO FUND THERE TERRORIST ACTIVITIES..

Anonymous said...

In the North versus South Brawl posting, I was impressed 50 surenos were able to organize an attack on the northern campers. Thats some sophisticated shit. It aint as easy as you'd think to organize 50 vatos for an assualt. When 50 insurgents get together, they can hit the US military hard. Think what 50 strapped surenos would do to cops. Or fifty nortenos , bulldogs, or greenlighters for that matter. That shit might happen in prison all day, but its not common for the streets. At least not around here (up north).

Anonymous said...

Hell no!
noone is going to be that major and live that humbly. The news is always blowing shit out of proportion when it comes to the size of the bust. Dont believe everything you read. The millions these guys supposedly make aren't there. The media is selling you a story at Sana's expense. I'm not saying the vato isn't chingon. Im saying the media blows shit up.

i've seen broke ass vatos touted as kingpins to make LE look good.

middle-aged white reporter said...

Okay, John. If you want to talk smack, it would help if you actually READ the whole of my post. I said exactly what you said, that the meetings were about business (meaning, the drug biz). And, no, I don’t think the EME truce had anything at all to do with protecting human life or well being. Here’s the thing: if you want to fight with me, at least read what I’ve written.

For the record, no, I don’t live in the ghetto, but my god children do, and I spend much of my waking hours in Boyle Heights.

So what is it you think I don’t know about Father Boyle and the rest? Lay it out, okay? If you want to throw mud balls, be specific, cite examples. I’d be interested to know what you think, as you’re clearly experienced. But use details. Don’t slam me with generalities. Back it up with facts, please.

Anonymous said...

Look I know what was said at the Salvador Park meeting in Santa Ana. It was not a truce, it was an order not to engage in drive by's.The idea was also to reduce the non-green lighted murders. You know keep it to a minimum. Sana did runs yards from the streets. He ran OCJ also. He is a High Ranking brother, that is a fact. If he had more guys from his crew in a yard he would have the keys. One thing for sure he kept out more then most guys with his pull. Shyrock was that way in his area for a long time. That was the idea, every one wanted to start acting a little more like LCN then just street gangsters.
Palm Hall

Anonymous said...

PS; Boxer changing governments is going to put allot of people in for a long time.

Anonymous said...

Leo Duarte knows if anyone. He has been the CAC at Palm Hall for a million years.That old crock eyed curly hair mad man..
(IN REFERANCE TO THE LA TIMES ARTICAL)

Anonymous said...

TO JOHN n WHITE REPORTER,
For starters,we as gangmembers
know what the meetings were about,
they were intended for members only,not for people to speculate on,so everybody was on the same page,as a matter of fact some varrios did call a truce,and some did not,drive by's were a no-no,
technically they still are,but who's gonna finger their homeboy out when he is puttn in work,you guys can't be serious,when JOHN is talking all that shit,and he is a big wannabe,doesn't know what he is talking about(HE MUST BE A GREENLIGHTER)to say that he aint
with this or that,fuck this and that,hey REPORTER!don't even answer
JOHNS post,look back and read when he is talking about giving head in Y.A.!don't take him serious,he is the type of fool that screws this site up!REPORTER nomatter what the reasons are for this or that,your not a gangmember,you wouldn't understand,your veiws are different
from a stand point,and if for what ever reason a gangster don't feel right about anything,then that person should straighten their shit up,or go with whatever program,unlike JOHN! the lil cry baby,i mean if he thinks the way he does then why don't he stay home
have a good life and don't worry about nothing,i bet he never banged before,sounds like a nosey kid.......

Anonymous said...

ALONG TIME AGO,
gangsters had a some what respect within their own community,many homies respected one another,each others families,and their elders,women and children,etc. etc. etc.,but back then there was older homies
laying down the law,keeping their boys in order,you know?they had a sence of pride,but then law enforcement got hard on the older vatos,thinking that would help prevent membership,boy they were wrong!!!cause you got lil knuckleheads gettin in gangs anyways,but know theres no leadership as to tell these lil vatos how to act,theres no one to put them on check,it got worse,lil gun toting fools robbing old ladies and shit,stealing for plain stupidity,not even to gain from it,
shooting innocent people for lame excuses,ther is no structure as to how to maintain yourself as a gangmember,and if there was older vatos to check their lil homies for getting out of hand,i believe things on the streets wouldn't be as random as they are,as far as murders,assaults,etc.,on innocent people,whether it's for the respect for the people,or not to attract attention on themselves from law enforcement,whatever the reason,i beleive that crime would be reduced to certain degree,if their was older vatos to put them on check,cause the cops are not all that fair with younger latinos or blacks,and in some cases choose the life of crime,since the cops already stereotyped them,

middle-aged white reporter said...

Hey, anonymous. Thanks for the explanation. I'm new to this site, so I appreciate your words. You're right. I'm an outsider. But I'm also a mother (and a reporter) who cares about a lot of people who lived through those years (and some of those who didn't). I also care about the kids coming up now, who are being affected by what it still happening out on the street.

In terms of gangs, I’ll always have a lot to learn. But it seems to me, if we hope to solve any of the problems in this city, both insiders and outsiders are needed. We’re all in this together.

Thanks again for your comments.

CONEX said...

you know you can say what you want about me but the facts dont change i have lived the life, done the time and got in the mix, ive seen some of these so called hard vatos come and go and also get punked when they were youngsters, it happens all the time and if you have been thru the system you should know this, lucky for me i was born a big vato and had lots of familia members that have been connected since the 60s so i also had automatic pull, i remember when i first hit wayside max and i was 18 years old iwas naturally big and alot of homies thought i was older and liked to kick it with me, to tell you the truth i got juice just for being big so vatos hardly ever challenged me , but anyways thats the past and like i said im not a greenlighter or maravilla im just a homie who stands on his own two feet and dont answer to anyone , its not my problem if you are some lil frio smoking shermhead and cant stand on your own two feet, but dont worry this taxation shall pass when enough gente are fed up and then you vatos will be ashamed of what you did to survive..

Anonymous said...

Wally ........

Two thumbs up for your praise of the expert input. Rich Valdemar is undoubtedly a wealth of info from the street gangs to the prison gang history in L.A. His knowledge of the Chicano gangster mentality is extremely introspective and invaluable.
The EME's "evolvement" is not a surprise to those who spawned this group. When Luis "Huero" Flores from Hawaiian Gardens conceived the Gang of Gangs notion at the Deuel Vocational Institution in Tracy, California, in 1957, he and his cohorts (fellow street gang leaders, predominately from L.A. and SoCal) had one purpose in mind: T-E-R-R-O-R-I-S-M.
They were arrogrant, ruthless, bulletproof (in their minds) and the ultimate incorrigibles. Their primary purpose for forming was NOT "to protect themselves from ..." or "to survive those bad concrete jungles ...." . From the beginning they sought to terrorize the prison system and to enjoy the creature comforts that a prisoner seeks while behind bars. The long range plan was to take their act (as in activities) to the outside. Of course, that vision was somewhat obscure back in the 1950's and 60's.
The EME has NEVER been motivated by ethnic pride and has, from Day 1, been considered an "equal opportunity exploiter".
Their community "involvement" in forming "truces" or in curtailing drive-by's had nothing to do with "assisting the community" as much as it did exerting its control for the furtherance of its criminal enterprise.
Community activists, local councilmen and media folks teamed up at one point to applaud the EME for doing what law enforcement could not: stop the indiscriminate drive-by's. Indeed, a regional map of LASO territory showed (0) homicides in a two-month period where normally you'd have several. It was eerie, alright, but we immediately understood that 1)you don't make a pact with the devil and 2)you never give in to terrorists. Their motives were crystal clear and they remain crystal clear to this day. Control is the word and distribution of drugs is the commodity EME seeks to peddle to the consumer.
A multitude of thanks must go out to the multi-agencies who continue to harass, identify, arrest and incarcerate those "few" who seek to make life miserable for the rest.
It's an uphill climb, for sure, and the EME will exist as long as street gangs are in business. Mr. Valdez could not have said it better: "...someone will step in to fill his shoes...." This applies to all these characters.
I didn't realize that Sana had pioneered the taxing of gangs and apparently this was going on for such a long period .... amazing!

TijuanaJailer

Anonymous said...

I have to agree with John on the fact alot of vatos tatted up and banging had smut on them for sucking chora in YA. I seen a vato who hit anyone with no fear. He wasn't able to kick it because a vato from his barrio told him all the homies had to get their asses fingered to insure no putos were amongst us. He let the homies stick a finger in his ass which made him no good for life. We would tell him he could get back in with some clean-up ( hitting a sureno) which he always did only to be told it wasn't enough and if he didn't like it, we'd all smash him. It was kinda sad because we were outnumbered by the surenos and yet the homies made this fool no good over a head game played by some vato who didn't like this vato from the calles. He wasn't afraid of anyone , just stupid and wanting to be accepted. I did my whole time in the car and have to admit this vato had more courage than me, he wasn't as smart though. What a waste of manpower. He could have been schooled into a helluva torpedo.

CONEX said...

there you go vato tell it like it is, some of you vatos like to clean the smut up but in la pinta its all about the stronger and smarter survive that why these vatos changed all that and started this taxation to be a member crap.. most of the youngsters if not all are like hyenas nowadays they can only run in packs not by themselves so if your gonna be a down sureno dont be ashamed of the sad things that happen amongst your selves. your now in the mix and pretty soon you too will get caught in a wreck so trucha homies

Don Quixote said...

Pretty good stream you got going but you do have some pretty large "Posers" such as "John" and this last post from some vato from up north. I am an old timer that grew up in Lincon Heights in the 50's and 60's and knew all the vatos from clover,Aves, Happy Valley, Hazard,Dogtown etc; and we were taught and knew the movidas from the veteranos by the time we were 9 or 10 yrs old and the first thing we were taught is to man up and never ever accept any homosexual overture without immediate and violent retaliation. Maybe in the NorCal varrio this guy grew up in letting someone stick thier finger up your ass was ok but not where I came from.And the thought of someone giving head in YA and then later being accepted! pure fiction. I recall being in LA Juvie when I was ten years old and being questioned by the other vatitos "If you were taking a shit and some guy comes in with a knife and it's either give up some roundeye or you die, what would you do? The right answer is "with shit flying out of your ass you get up swinging and die if you must but never give up no booty.

Anonymous said...

TO: (Don Quixote said...
Pretty good stream you got going but you do have some pretty large "Posers")

It's always been about "apples and oranges", DonQ. The Norteno and Sureno mentality has been similar in some respects but sooo very dissimilar in most.
A veterano informant once related to me how a group of dudes from L.A. would sit on the S.Q. yard and watch the "fish" roll up and cross the Upper Yard and they would make wagers: by looking at the way they walked and their mannerisms, they could tell you which Chicanos were from L.A. (or So.Cal) and which were from the North. I won't get into the way he defined the different struts so as to not offend anyone but it's amazing how these guys could "read" people.
Whether a guy is a hard core banger or a wannabe, they can pose varying degrees of threat. The wannabe may indeed evolve into a deadly hitter but generally speaking, I agree with Don Q, there is a different breed of bad guys that exist between Norte y Sur.
I remember when the Prison Gang Task Force members of the 70's and 80's were almost embarrassed to admit that they were working the NF. Can you believe that? It even extended into law enforcement!!
Bottom line: It just doesn't matter. Bad guys are bad guys. It only takes but an mili-ounce of pressure to pull a trigger.

Tijuana Jailer

Anonymous said...

I remember those rules coming down the chain of command that there was to be NO MORE DRIVE BY SHOOTINGS, that was it no truce nothing else just no more shooting from a car.

RetiredJoker said...

Its funny how you vatos who have only lived in So Cal know so much about nortenos. I lived in and around San Jose for 20 years before moving down here 5 years ago. And besides the color of their rags, you couldn't tell a difference between a Norteno and a Sureno. I never heard of no homo shit in CYA or Juvie. Just doesn't happen, that vato is telling second hand stories he heard from someone else. Retired Joker.

RetiredJoker said...

Its funny how you vatos who have only lived in So Cal know so much about nortenos. I lived in and around San Jose for 20 years before moving down here 5 years ago. And besides the color of their rags, you couldn't tell a difference between a Norteno and a Sureno. A down ass carnal is a down ass carnal no matter where they are from. Just like a sucker is a sucker and a rat is a rat.
I never heard of no homo shit in CYA or Juvie. Just doesn't happen, that vato is telling second hand stories he heard from someone else. Retired Joker.

Anonymous said...

I on the other hand grew up in southern cali live here all my live im 30 now then I moved to northern cali for a couple of years for a job and moved back because its so lame up there and you can definately tell the difference those vatos up there act like they are black call each other the N word and everything nothing against black folks, but there is a big defference and you can tell homie

RetiredJoker said...

You must've been in the east bay towards Oakland. I will admit the homeboys in the east bay do act like blacks. Parts of San Fran are like that too. But in San Jose the tradition is much older and more a true chicano style where Oakland is mostly black influenced. You have to remember that the Black Panther party came from Oaktown as well as the Hells Angels for that matter, but Oakland has been predominatley black until the 90's. San Jose was NF HQ in the 80 and part of the 90's until the moved to Stockton to cool off the head from operation black widow. Some of the oldest Norteno Barrios are in East San Jose. But from Mountain Veiw Down to Salinas and up to Fremont,They do not sound blacks.

Anonymous said...

The vato who let the homies stick a finger in his ass was a bulldog. He had a huge ESF14 across his neck. Now I don't have to tell you alot of chingon vatos come from there. I also said he was never any good after that so we don't let that shit happen up here either. He was mentally weak and culled from the pack. Personally, I would have schooled him and made him a torpedo.This isn't second hand shit I heard. I was there. Go to the Clanton14 website and ask if that vato Clever they have on their website under vatos torcidos wasn't at Chad in 90. He was down to throw chingadozos but not very good at it. Any homie who wanted to earn easy points chose clever to get off with. My experience was the surenos had to do shit when deep. The homies usually banged them up in even matches. The homies did like to try and program more than the surenos though. (the gang mentality didn't run as deep) We would call them swimmers because they always came swinging with their heads down. In spite of the BGF/NF alliance, most the nortenos I know hate blacks. Surenos shouldn't talk too much trash about that though because I recall them talking shit about nortenos for liking rap music, now they have rival sureno rappers jocking to be the best rapper. The Eme should tax them if they are trying to make money by identifying themselves as sureno gangsters though. I like reading the posts here but must say to all you who have been there and called me a poser, "I'm not the one naming names and putting everyone's business out there" the way some of you be dry snitching makes me wonder if you ever had any criminal schooling. I think you guys are the posers talking about everyone's business and including their names. Real gangsters/ retired or not wouldn't do that.

RetiredJoker said...

Hey holmes, Speaking of Latin Gangster rap. Whats up with Sir Dyno nowadays. I heard he caught a mean case getting caught up with that Rata, gratton. All that business with the G.U.N. CD.
Apparantly the NF let Gratton handle the G.U.N. project to unite the nortenos on the street and launder some money while they were at it. When Gratton got caught slipping (skimmin money off the top) and was indicted he implicated a whole shit load of homies and poor Sir Dyno got caught up in the mix. Sir Dyno was never really a hard core banger but he used to slang and has an association with Nortenos. Do you know how much time he got? His old crew Darkroom Familia was pretty tight. Its a shame he got caught up in the mix with that rat. He was trying to go straigh, with his CD's and Movies. Low budget, straight to video flicks but you gotta support a brother when he's trying to make it in the white mans world.

Anonymous said...

I no longer maintain contact with most of the homies because they only seemed to bring each other and me down. And these are the people I grew up with. But when I see them always drunk or on drugs I have to realize they aint going anywhere in life. I probably make more and live better than most of the surenos and nortenos because I went to college and got away from that shit. Now, I no longer look at gang members as bad assess worth emulating but more as patsies waiting to be manipulated for my own good. Thats the bulk of the gang members, everyone can't be a Joe Morgan or Cheyenne Cadena.

RetiredJoker said...

I agree with you in that part. I'm 34 now, and work and live in south orange county. I haven't been back to my stomping grounds in the bay area in years. Everyone is dead or locked up. The ones that aren't are strung out on meth and ain't doing shit with their lives. I still keep in touch with 3 or 4 homeboys that I grew up with that are keepin it legit with their families and what not. Sometimes you just gotta grow up and claim the gang that is most important, Your wife and kids. Be down for you and your loved ones and you can't go wrong.

Anonymous said...

I don't know what became of
Sir Dyno. I don't think the NF is too happy with him though. Sir Dyno presented an image of being chingon so I guess he got his wish. He was tried with some chingones and looked upon as one by the average joe. I bought gratton book and he never struck me as particularly savage. Maybe someone else used him as a front. When I was at preston, sometimes a shotcaller would have someone else pretend to be the shotcaller for avoiding detection and thus tamarack.

Anonymous said...

Sir Dyno is up in Sac right now, I think he'll do acouple years. They had a special on A&E about that prison last month. It was pretty good, basically breakin down the B & C yards and then the A yard (PC).

RetiredJoker said...

I agree with you in that part. I'm 34 now, and work and live in south orange county. I haven't been back to my old stomping grounds in the bay in years. I keep in touch with a handful of homies who are doing right for themsevles. Everyone else is either dead or locked up. The ones that aren't, are strung out on meth and ain't doing shit with their lives. Sometimes you just gotta grow up and claim the gang that is most important, Your wife and kids. Be down for your your family and loved ones and you'll be ok.

RetiredJoker said...

Yea, Sir Dyno definitely signed a deal with the devil, thinking he could be a citizen and not implicate himself. He even admitted he only rapped about being hard on the steets but once reality kicked in, now he's doing hard time for some hard core rhymes. Hey, look, I'm can rap too!

Anonymous said...

Grattons book has him getting busted for selling a quarter ounce of meth to an undercover before he turned over. That was hella weak because in the book he claims to be the third highest ranking captain in the NF and he's selling quarter O's ? What's that ? A hundred bucks? What a joke!

Anonymous said...

regarding my comments earlier I was in sacramento and those vatos act like they are black too.

Anonymous said...

I'm not a gang member or former gang member, but reading IN THE HAT is very intersting. Thanks to all who've posted and thanks to Wally as well.

Here is a link I found regarding that rapper Sir Dyno:

http://www.eastbayexpress.com/issues/2003-10-01/feature.html

Anonymous said...

This is getting kinda crazy, I know when I was in the pen you would have to do a thosand burbies and big ass old essay if you rapped. I am serious. If you was in Palm Hall you would anyway. Or any other SHU or 4 yard. I only got to go to one 3/4 main line soledad central in the early eighties and that was a bit more laxed.Lots of North South stuff, but it would kick off then mellow out for a while and eveything was everything. I think the woods are the sotherners get along because in the lower middle class areas around LA they are mixed and up north in the cities the blacks and the northerners are in the same areas. A few older brothers are straight white. Some of them even fell with guys that ended up brand or were at the time. Most the youger brand members I knew acted like chicano's in YA. They road with the woods, but had slicked back hair and did the whole three buttoned down shirt thing.You also get southerners that act kind of white, speak little spanish. I am not a everyone love everyone, but I think its all about enviroment. It is a shame that it is so political, but everyone can't be that guy.SO you gotta expect that when things get big you will have factions and enemies that one would think would be alies.
Palm Hall.

Anonymous said...

Here's something I noticed during my YA adventure. If there were 20 nortenos and 20 surenos we would fued with each other. If there were no surenos, the 20 nortenos would break up into two camps (those that sided with Fresno and those that sided with San Jo-at the time Fresno was still riding with us) If all the homies from San Jo were shipped out, then Fresno vatos would start fueding amongst themselves by breaking into the Parkside camp and the East Side camp. ( I'm guessing they're tighter now since going bulldog)
Anyways, I started noticing woods claiming norcal peckerwood banging against socal peckerwoods if they got deep enough. I met some guys who'd been to Nelles YA and (this is hearsay) heard the 18 street had their own dorm cause they fueded with everyone at the time. Since I didn't get shipped to YTS my info is hearsay on southern Youth Authority institutions where it was my understanding the surenos fueded big time amongst themselves over varrio pride. Of course this was all before the bulldogs dropped out and the Eme edicts and before all these surenos moved up north. We didn't have surenos in my town when I got locked up, but plenty when I got out. Maybe the eme edicts have brought surenos together but I doubt LA and San Diego don't fued occasionally over regional pride.
I seen no end. If we wiped out the surenos, we'd fued over citylife nortenos vs farmeros, if the farmeros lost, tye citylifers would fued over who's city was the best, if my city became the deepest, we'd fued over whose varrio was the best. The woods did the same thing, the blacks did the same thing, and the surenos did same thing. This was YA circa late 80's early 90's and not prison. I'm sure its alot more structured in there. Never been.
Of course alot has changed in the last 15 years. Damn its been a long time. And you know what I sure had fun doing it!

StillNoScript said...

To Anonymous..who said that vatos in Sacramento act black:

They do in some instances. But like the bay area, it's primarily in black neighborhoods.

There are a few neighborhoods in Sac, however, where I'm almost certain that mexican people connected to the gang life act mexican. They may listen to rap, but that's it.

I'm not an expert, but I'm just guessing that Broderick (West Sac), Northgate, and Centro (Downtown) would be a few examples. These are old school, tight-knit mexican neighborhoods.

StillNoScript said...

To Anonymous..who said that vatos in Sacramento act black:

They do in some instances. But like the bay area, it's primarily in black neighborhoods.

There are a few neighborhoods in Sac, however, where I'm almost certain that mexican people connected to the gang life act mexican. They may listen to rap, but that's it.

I'm not an expert, but I'm just guessing that Broderick (West Sac), Northgate, and Centro (Downtown) would be a few examples. These are old school, tight-knit mexican neighborhoods.

Anonymous said...

What's goin on with the injunction with the Broderick Boys x4 in Sac?

StillNoScript said...

What's going on with the injuction of the Broderick Boys in West Sac?

I'll tell you this much, there's new condos and resturaunts going up everywhere near the river, which is in the heart of Broderick. So, I'm assuming it's because the police are really concerned about the citizens of Broderick and protecting them from gang members. Ha ha ha. Yeh, Right.

Just like the San Jose injuction, racist bullshit. Businesses go up, here comes an injuction.

I'd read a blog by a college student who's fighting the injuction that there are people on the Broderick injuction that haven't even been in the neighborhood for years. There was one dude who was visiting his grandmother, and made the mistake of going to the store with a red football shirt on. Cops gaffled him right in front of the store.

"Are you a Broderick Boy?"

"I used to live here..."

"Yep, he is. File him."

Hitler would be proud.

Anonymous said...

To the Tijuana Jailer:
What did your remark about the members of the Prison Gang Task Force; they were ashamed to say they were working the N.F. mean?

I do not want to step into a pile of caca until I get your meaning of it. I knew the ones that worked in the "Trailer" that had the task of monitoring the N.F. during the 1970's and never heard them complain about their assignment. Maybe some of those from other agencies that were "attached" to the trailer made the comments but to my knowledge I never heard that. The main impetus at the "Trailer was the eMe, this was because of their "street" involvement in the early 1970's. (Executions, drug take overs etc.)

Wil E. Coyote

Anonymous said...

To the WilECoyote:
(What did your remark about the members of the Prison Gang Task Force; they were ashamed to say they were working the N.F. mean?)

We were discussing the difference between So. Cal gang members/cons and their NorCal counterparts. My reference was to PGTF members who needled those who were assigned to work NF. Some of the guys weren't overly thrilled about their assignment and there were some exchanges (we can leave it at that) at times.
If your relationship with the guys from the "trailer" continues to this day, just ask the "short Mexican" whose agency was in charge of the PGTF at that time and he will share some great accounts about what you ask in great detail. Just ask him about the time we were at a park with a couple of "friendlies" and the argument that ensued in their presence. He'll remember.
(Hell, I even recall the feds expressing a similar sentiment. In 1977-78, a warning was shared with the BOP folks that EME members would be headed into their system and they responded in effect by telling us: "We have the REAL Mafia ....". They didn't take EME seriously until the cancer had spread).
You've been around long enough to know which LE assignments are considered "prestigious" and which are not.

Now I need to go mow my lawn.

Cheers,

Tijuana Jailer

Anonymous said...

ORALE'!

Anonymous said...

TU Plus Tu

Anonymous said...

All i know is i love mexican convicts from prison . i used to be with a firme con from coachella but he died. im a white girl from there w blue eyes pretty too and i love to have rufffffff sex with cons. when i can find one mmmmmmmm i love the tatoos the straight look in there eyes all the head games there walk style. mmm and the sex is real good in all 3 holes. yes im crazy. the huera M

Anonymous said...

whats up huera hook it up whats your email.

Anonymous said...

Hey, white girl. How many black eyes have your received in your life??
What do you say to a woman with two black eyes??
Nothing, she's been told twice. ;o)

Anonymous said...

Watch it. NLR reads posts too.

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Anonymous said...

CHUCO AND BOXER...SHIT,THE "NO DRIVE-BY'S" ORDER CAME FROM A BIG HOMIE DOING FED TIME.BOXER GAVE UP 30 PAGES OF MATERIAL. SHHHH!!!!!

Anonymous said...

I worked with Leo Duarte for years. He's a good guy. He just retired a couple of weeks back. I'm next...May '07.Twenty-five years in the joint is enough for ANYBODY! Seen enough crazy shit to fill a library. Goin fishin...Fuck the rest!

Loco John